A real Camber question to solve the dispute

[camcar se]

So I have researched the he!! out of this camber dispute. I have a 99 Solara se 5spd V6 and I want to drop it and I am gonna go with teins/tokico. Some say we need it some say we dont.

The ones who dont are sayin that 1 degree or so is ok. I dont want one degree off I want perfection so this question is more for the people who got the camber kits.
1. Did the shops get you cars allignment to perfect degrees with the kit.
2. Could they put it on after you installed your suspension and wetn and got an allignment.
3. Does everything seem ok
4. Was it a plate or a bolt.
5. And which one are you using, Eibach or this toyota one I hear about. Where do you get it.
6. And last what setup are you using and how is it. Ride quality and cornering. I am still stuck between eibach and tein. Thanks Guys Later

[2002greenhornet]

I have a 2002 (Gen 1.5) with Tein/Tokico and no camber kit. Manufacturer's specifications for alignment tolerances are always provided as an acceptable range. For instance, the caster acceptable range for our car (for which there is no adjustment on the Solara) is stated as 1.4 to 2.9 degrees. Actual on mine is 2.3 on one side and 2.4 on the other. So to get comfortably within Toyota's acceptable range for Camber and Toe is all you need and you don't need a camber kit to do it with these parts. So as you can see, "perfection" is relative, as there is no "zero". What matters is whether the car rolls straight and the tires wear evenly. Getting in the range should do that. My car rolls straight and smooth and, although, the tires are new, I'm confident the tires will wear correctly.

As always, I'm open to someone correcting me there is something I'm missing.

[bassthrive]

Just got my Tein and Tokico combo installed on my 2000 gen1. My front camber was at -1.4 so if left unchanged, down the road my tires would be wearing away at the inside corner. A camber kit was installed to get everything up to perfect specs. That dosent mean it is absolutely necessary, but I would highly recommend a kit, even if only dropping 1.5-1.75 inches - your camber will be out.

The kit they used was a bolt with a cam on it that could be turned to adjust camber negative or positive. The toyota bolt that was in there from factory has no such adjustment so changing the camber on our cars is basically impossible?

Heres my review of the overall suspension....

Looks great, slight rake to the front, 1.5 finger gap front, 2 rear.
Handles like a dream, no squat or lean - I dont feel like im driving a boat anymore.
Ride is suprisingly compliant with these progressively wound teins. You may feel more road flaws and have to slow down a lot for speed bumps but the overall comfort of the ride is excellent.

[2002greenhornet]

My front camber was at -1.4 so if left unchanged, down the road my tires would be wearing away at the inside corner.

Time will tell. Mine was at -1.4 too, which we were able to adjust to -0.9 (RF) and -1.1 (LF), which is within the Specified Range of -1.3 to +0.2. You and I are the perfect lab experiment! We both had ours done at about the same time. Yours with, mine without, see what happens. It will take a few thousand miles, but let's definitely keep in touch on this. I'm very curious.

A camber kit was installed to get everything up to perfect specs.

What are "perfect specs"? If you have your print-out from the alignment machine, could you post the Actual, Before and Specified Range numbers? I'd like to compare them with mine.

The kit they used was a bolt with a cam on it that could be turned to adjust camber negative or positive. The toyota bolt that was in there from factory has no such adjustment so changing the camber on our cars is basically impossible?

Not impossible at all. Mine was adjusted to well within the Specified Range numbers without the kit.

Heres my review of the overall suspension....

Looks great, slight rake to the front, 1.5 finger gap front, 2 rear.
Handles like a dream, no squat or lean - I dont feel like im driving a boat anymore. Ride is suprisingly compliant with these progressively wound teins. You may feel more road flaws and have to slow down a lot for speed bumps but the overall comfort of the ride is excellent.

I agree completely. I'm loving the handling, the look and the ride. I WANT to feel the road. It corners like a completely different car...

[bassthrive]

Time will tell. Mine was at -1.4 too, which we were able to adjust to -0.9 (RF) and -1.1 (LF), which is within the Specified Range of -1.3 to +0.2. You and I are the perfect lab experiment! We both had ours done at about the same time. Yours with, mine without, see what happens. It will take a few thousand miles, but let's definitely keep in touch on this. I'm very curious.

Yeah great experiment we got here. Lets monitor our wear pattern and compare.

What are "perfect specs"? If you have your print-out from the alignment machine, could you post the Actual, Before and Specified Range numbers?

If memory serves, ideal OE camber is -.50 +/-.02
Mine is -.52 with the kit.

Mine was adjusted to well within the Specified Range numbers without the kit.

My shop said they physically couldnt get it within the allowable range as is so thats why the kit was necessary. I also weighed the costs of buying a $28 set of bolts to replacing two tires.

[townboy2]

after i have my tokico and eibach installed and went to first alligment shop and done by PC and off by 2.1 on driver side also that shop don't do the camber kit thing.. so i went to a different shop which use by hand and the shop owner look at my car and he told me that we don't need a camber kit cause we using the bolt one and he fixed the problem but that took him like 2-3 hours...

[CASTRO]

ive got a 97 camry with a 1mz dropped on JIC Magic FLT-A1US coilovers. Dropped and slamed my car when i first got it and let me tell you., the more its dropped. the worse the camber problem will become. I've had the inside shoulders of my tires (low profile dunlop sp sport9000) eat away and it saw less than 10k miles. IT had 260 treadwear and I feel that it was a good indicator of the camber issue. I raised it up some and problems went away. Specs were withing the factory rec and new tires didnt wear as fast. Mechanic said it was due to metal fatigue and the more its dropped, the more stress is put on the parts which causes it to bendgive under the lowered condition. So... depending of the weight of your car, age, suspension conditions, etc etc etc you May or May NOT need a camber kit. All cars are created differently. BTW other mods include a TRD front strut as well as a rear TRD sway set on track.

[2002greenhornet]

If memory serves, ideal OE camber is -.50 +/-.02

Where did you get this number? All the alignment machine print-outs I've seen show a specified range that's wider than that for any car. Did you get a print-out? Please don't think I'm trying to bust you or be "right" to puff up my ego, I really want to get to the bottom of this in case I'm wrong.

I had mine dropped at a respected speed shop--family owned, builds and races rally cars; has built two of the fastest Solaras on this board (Shidosha01 and Paladin06Greg) with another one coming (JoeB)--and they said that a camber kit is unnecessary.

[Vi3tT3kNiqz]

i dropped my car with tein springs. Lets say if i need to get an alignment, does the alignment go according to toyota specs or are there any other specs?

[2002greenhornet]

i dropped my car with tein springs. Lets say if i need to get an alignment, does the alignment go according to toyota specs or are there any other specs?

If you didn't get an alignment, the camber is going to be out. The Specified Range specs are according to Toyota, set for what is an acceptable maximum plus or minus angle off of perfectly straight up and down.

[camcar se]

bassthrive wrote
The kit they used was a bolt with a cam on it that could be turned to adjust camber negative or positive.

So did this person who did yours just have this kit in stock or did you buy it somewhere.

And to the negative people, this question has been asked many times I realize but never done to this extent. My goal is not to ask weither its needed, but to provide myself along with many many others what people with and without camber kits are experiencing, if you dont want to read it, dont. Not trying to be a prick or anything but if someone doesnt want to read a forum post regardless of what it is, then simply dont click on it and let people who are interested in it go on there way just as everyone has done at one time.
Thanks to all who have posted so far youve been great.[/quote]

[20SoLaRa02]

things may not be as good as stock. but if things are off from stock specs and there is something that can be done to help get numbers closer to specs, people are going to do it and there is going to be discussion about it. sorry but i just had to get my 2 cents in. i'd like to see this thread continue as i have found it useful. so can we get back on topic please .

thank you,
michael

[2002greenhornet]

...something that can be done to help get numbers closer to specs

Again, "specs" is not a single number, but is given as an acceptable Specified Range. If you've ever seen an alignment print-out, you will see this number (along with the Before and After numbers). Any alignment that is within this range is considered to be "to specs." If you're talking about zero degrees camber, that's another thing and may not be ultimately necessary. Since the OEM "spec" is a range, then to me that says there will not be tire wear or other problems of any significance if adjusted to within that range. Otherwise, why give a Range?

I had a '94 Diamante that got stolen and had the left front lower control arm damaged. They had to do some frame work to fix it and get it aligned to within specs (the Range). The right, undamaged side was something like -.04 and the left, repaired side was like -1.1 (the best they could do without cutting and welding. I drove the car another 20k miles before selling it, and in both ride and tire wear, there were no problems at all.