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SolaraGuy.com • View topic - Electronic Data Recorder (Black Box)
Stock talk about the Generation 2 and 2.5 Toyota Solara which was released in 2004-2007

Electronic Data Recorder (Black Box)

Electronic Data Recorder (Black Box)

Postby FLUXEMAG » Fri Aug 25, 2006 4:26 pm

So I was cruising through my manual a while back and noticed a disclaimer stating that certain parameters are recorded in a black box on new Solaras. This is for use by law enforcement or Toyota, but not you. So if you drive fast, or don't hit the brakes, or weren't wearing your seatbelt, Toyota can defend themselves from your law suits. Also, if police are investigating an accident you were involved in, they can pull up your speed and braking records. Just an FYI... didn't change my driving though.
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Postby MCOjerry » Fri Aug 25, 2006 9:04 pm

There has been talk about this for a LONG time. Where in the manual was it? Personally, I think it's an invasion of privacy.
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Postby murr » Sat Aug 26, 2006 5:27 am

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Postby MCOjerry » Sat Aug 26, 2006 6:56 am

This whole thing pisses me off. I know I said it already, but damn, who invented this thing, George Orwell?
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Postby JadedEMOlush » Sat Aug 26, 2006 12:03 pm

Well I have to disagree here, as there have been numerous cases both proving innocence and proving guilt with these. If you were somewhat within the law, it will clear your name... this can assist you from being wrongly convicted if God forbid you were involved in a hit, or vehicular homicide etc. For example on the other end a couple years ago a small child was hit and killed in a residential neighborhood, just feet from her house.... (sorry I do not have a link for the case). but the defense lawyers were claiming the driver was well within the speed limit 25 MPH, when the data recorder showed at the point of impact the driver was doing something like 90 miles per hour when he killed the child. I agree with having fun, racing all within reason... but there is no place for that when some childs life could be snuffed out.
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Postby mik00725 » Sun Aug 27, 2006 7:18 am

I was going to post about thi after reading the following article:

http://edition.cnn.com/2006/AUTOS/08/22 ... index.html

My opinion on this is that it could used for the wrong purpose. Maybe insurance compnaies can get access to this data
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Postby MCOjerry » Sun Aug 27, 2006 8:59 am

JadedEMOlush wrote:Well I have to disagree here, as there have been numerous cases both proving innocence and proving guilt with these. If you were somewhat within the law, it will clear your name... this can assist you from being wrongly convicted if God forbid you were involved in a hit, or vehicular homicide etc. For example on the other end a couple years ago a small child was hit and killed in a residential neighborhood, just feet from her house.... (sorry I do not have a link for the case). but the defense lawyers were claiming the driver was well within the speed limit 25 MPH, when the data recorder showed at the point of impact the driver was doing something like 90 miles per hour when he killed the child. I agree with having fun, racing all within reason... but there is no place for that when some childs life could be snuffed out.


I understand your point, but still think it's an invasion of privacy. There are lot of things that could be done to catch would be criminals, and it's hard to draw the line.

Would you also say that it's OK to install a camera in your car to tell the police what you were doing right before a crash? "Officer, I swear I wan't on my cell phone, eating Kentucky Fried Chicken or applying my makeup, I was paying attention to the road!". The oficer says, "Well, let's just download the feed from that little camera in your rear view mirror and see if you re telling the truth". Just think of what else that office might find was captured on that camera.

Each step we take, brings us cloer to fewer freedoms, IMO.

The world is becoming entirely too complicated.
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Postby DocJohn » Tue Aug 29, 2006 7:15 am

MCOjerry wrote:
JadedEMOlush wrote:Well I have to disagree here, as there have been numerous cases both proving innocence and proving guilt with these. If you were somewhat within the law, it will clear your name... this can assist you from being wrongly convicted if God forbid you were involved in a hit, or vehicular homicide etc. For example on the other end a couple years ago a small child was hit and killed in a residential neighborhood, just feet from her house.... (sorry I do not have a link for the case). but the defense lawyers were claiming the driver was well within the speed limit 25 MPH, when the data recorder showed at the point of impact the driver was doing something like 90 miles per hour when he killed the child. I agree with having fun, racing all within reason... but there is no place for that when some childs life could be snuffed out.


I understand your point, but still think it's an invasion of privacy. There are lot of things that could be done to catch would be criminals, and it's hard to draw the line.

Would you also say that it's OK to install a camera in your car to tell the police what you were doing right before a crash? "Officer, I swear I wan't on my cell phone, eating Kentucky Fried Chicken or applying my makeup, I was paying attention to the road!". The oficer says, "Well, let's just download the feed from that little camera in your rear view mirror and see if you re telling the truth". Just think of what else that office might find was captured on that camera.

Each step we take, brings us cloer to fewer freedoms, IMO.

The world is becoming entirely too complicated.


I have to agree with both of you. With any technology like this one, there is always the potential for its abuse and its invasion of our privacy. ("Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety.")

On the other hand, if I were the parent of the child who was killed by the criminal idiot who was going 90 mph in a residential neighborhood, I would be glad the "black box" data was available to convict him and land his a$$ in jail.
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Postby FLUXEMAG » Tue Aug 29, 2006 9:41 am

So how do we disable it? Hmmm, I don't lease so I should be able to do it, but maybe it's like removing an existing airbag (unlawful). It's probably just a rom chip on the ECU board that you could put a clip on top of to short out the memory. I don't think I'd do that with the stock ECU, maybe an aftermarket one which isn't made yet (right?).
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Postby that1mexguy » Tue Aug 29, 2006 10:47 am

MCOjerry wrote:The world is becoming entirely too complicated.


Uh no, i disagree.. not the world, the world has been f*up for centuries, it's the US getting too complicated, and yes... sad to say it but with all these laws that watch over people, what they eat, what they watch, what they do, the 1st thought that comes to mind is: communism! yeah i said it!!!
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Postby Sebas007 » Tue Aug 29, 2006 11:23 am

man...I think you highlight something there !! I think you say right !! I never thought abo ut it in this way but it really is !! :o

that1mexguy wrote:
MCOjerry wrote:The world is becoming entirely too complicated.


Uh no, i disagree.. not the world, the world has been f*up for centuries, it's the US getting too complicated, and yes... sad to say it but with all these laws that watch over people, what they eat, what they watch, what they do, the 1st thought that comes to mind is: communism! yeah i said it!!!
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Postby Turbosolara » Tue Aug 29, 2006 11:37 am

MCOjerry wrote:
JadedEMOlush wrote:Well I have to disagree here, as there have been numerous cases both proving innocence and proving guilt with these. If you were somewhat within the law, it will clear your name... this can assist you from being wrongly convicted if God forbid you were involved in a hit, or vehicular homicide etc. For example on the other end a couple years ago a small child was hit and killed in a residential neighborhood, just feet from her house.... (sorry I do not have a link for the case). but the defense lawyers were claiming the driver was well within the speed limit 25 MPH, when the data recorder showed at the point of impact the driver was doing something like 90 miles per hour when he killed the child. I agree with having fun, racing all within reason... but there is no place for that when some childs life could be snuffed out.


I understand your point, but still think it's an invasion of privacy. There are lot of things that could be done to catch would be criminals, and it's hard to draw the line.

Would you also say that it's OK to install a camera in your car to tell the police what you were doing right before a crash? "Officer, I swear I wan't on my cell phone, eating Kentucky Fried Chicken or applying my makeup, I was paying attention to the road!". The oficer says, "Well, let's just download the feed from that little camera in your rear view mirror and see if you re telling the truth". Just think of what else that office might find was captured on that camera.

Each step we take, brings us cloer to fewer freedoms, IMO.

The world is becoming entirely too complicated.


i disagree with you right here, i felt it will brings more justice. They will not collect the data in the blackbox unless you had accident, so in that case, i really dont think it is a invasion of privacy. We still have our fundemental rights to do various thing, but it just a device recording the truth before any accident. the cop cannot just pull you over and check the blackbox, it is not for the purpose.

A while ago there are two young guy was riding a corvette and had collision with a old lady, who die from the accident. Those two dudes claim they were only going 50 mph and the blackbox showed they went 130 mph before the accident. They were convicted and jailed.
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Postby that1mexguy » Tue Aug 29, 2006 1:48 pm

I agree with you guys in the use of this black box to prove innocence or guilt when it comes to cases like mentioned before, but I guess what the other guys are trying to say is that this box is getting closer and closer to monitoring our driving habits and it could possibly be misused in the future. Perhaps I am over analyzing the situation but what is to say this could be a gateway to micro chips implanted in our bodies? many can argue this could help in proving guilt or innocence as well and we can say that this chip can be used ONLY when necessary but do you think that is really going to be the case? I really don't care what they do because I aint got nothing to hide (there goes my insurance rates once they find out my driving habits lol), but this can be argued from either side, and my @$$ loves to argue!!!! oh yeah, and for those of you that dont like the idea about the black box, keep in mind it's a computer, and just like any computer it can be rigged for the right amount... so now that brings me to the other side of the argument, how can we always make sure this black box is 100% effective? ... (switching sides again) we cant, because as long as there is a will, there is a way and money can buy another programer to "fix" the box .... damn it, i think i am arguing against myself here, come on people, jump in!!! LOL

PS. the point I'm trying to make is yes it sounds like a great idea, but at the same time it can turn around and bites us in the behind because for as long as we continue to add technology to our daily living, we are only allowing "others" to see our every move and there goes that word again ... communism... think about it. :drinking:
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Postby FLUXEMAG » Tue Aug 29, 2006 2:30 pm

Maybe they'll find the thruthiness.
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Postby MCOjerry » Tue Aug 29, 2006 4:57 pm

To the question about disabling: Someone posted a link to an article a few posts back. It says that the boxes are so intermingled with the electronics of the cars, and all the sensors, it's virtually impossible to disable it without messing up your car.

Now, let me ask all those in favor of these: What would you say if you took your car in for warranty service, and they refused it becuase they read the info in your black box and found out that you consistently over rev your engine, or drive over 100 MPH frequently. If they can prove that you mistreat your car, they can possibly refuse warranty repair.

Now, the articles say the boxes only record a few seconds before and after an accident, but who's to say that in the future car makers don't change that to record months worth of data. There's certainly room in any car for some kind of hard drive to keep the data. This is just the start.

Maybe the police will be able to plug into your car next time they pull you over and PROVE you were speeding or driving recklessly. Think about that! Think about all of the things you do while driving that could get you a ticket if you got caught and think about the next generation of that little black box.

There are too many abuses possible with this type of technology. At the very least, you should have the option to have it disconnected by the dealer.
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