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Timing......

Timing......

Postby JavaJoe_2 » Sun Oct 26, 2008 11:15 am

Anybody mess with it??
On Silverlicious Greg had any where from -1 to -5 deg. pulled mid to top end.
I'm going to try it without the pull.
Also fuel trims are -5 short to -15 long term so I'm going to try and even them out. He had +9 @ idle with 370cc injectors.
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Postby Dawgz » Sun Oct 26, 2008 3:07 pm

lol @ +9 @ idle....well, isnt his motor low compression?


and, ur messn with timing, so uve got the ftc on there or wat are u using?
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Postby JavaJoe_2 » Sun Oct 26, 2008 4:19 pm

Dawgz wrote:lol @ +9 @ idle....well, isnt his motor low compression?


and, ur messn with timing, so uve got the ftc on there or wat are u using?



Low compression heads were never under his mods listed. And why would it be @ +9 @ idle with low compression heads? Is anybody else using 370cc injectors?
And I'm using the Greddy E-Manage for the tuning.
I believe that he pulled the timing due to the high temps in AZ. That's why he went with the intercooler and the Aqua Mist. The high today here was about 50 deg. So, I don't think I really need to worry about the temp issue.
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Postby Eye8Pussies » Sun Oct 26, 2008 6:35 pm

when you said that he had +9 at idle, is that what the ecu fuel trim is? or is that his own adjustments at idle?

not too sure why he would need to add fuel at idle, but by the same token, I'm not sure what he's really done to the car.

by the same token though, could you give us a better idea of the kinds of adjustments he has made, fuel-wise throughout the power range? are they all + numbers, or do they also then go to - ?

because with 370cc injectors, generally speaking, he won't need to + and more fuel than the injectors and a good fuel system can supply. ESPECIALLY since he also has meth injection.


as for timing...not sure why he would need to pull timing either. I was under the impression that after the intercooling, knock wasn't really an issue, and with the meth, he said that he gained power, which is done by advancing timing

so, on that one, your guess is probably as good as ours. this is something that would very hard to help you figure outwithout knowing the extent of his modifications throughout and within, as well as see all the tuning options on the emanage

the possibility for the +9 at idle could be because the settings on the emange were fooled around with to make the emanage work well with ecu, since emanage blue and the stock 1mz ecu does not work very well together.....pretty much everybody who's dealt with blue with our engines usually end up throwing it out the window for something else. If the car's got ultimate though...then no idea. lol
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Postby JavaJoe_2 » Sun Oct 26, 2008 9:00 pm

The +9 @ idle was the fuel trim that he set. The ecu was pulling 14.8 long term not sure what the short was pulling.
All of the setting are @ +9 and range to +50 for the fuel map, if I remember right. Although when you really stand on it, (goes into open loop) the a/f gauge bounces from 12.1 to 12.6 or right around there. I'll be replacing the AEM a/f gauge with the Innovate for a more accurate reading.
Now as for the timing map only on the top end does he pull the timing. I know things change running a meth injection at lower rpms because the ks (I believe) only work above 3k rpm. Above 3k will change with the meth injection. And also have an affect the ecu timing changes below that. (am I making sence?)

Gadget wrote:Now because the low RPM timing
below 3000 RPM is set based on an extrapolation of high RPM timing the low
RPM timing will get more advance and there will be more of a tendency for boost
induced spark knock below 3000 RPM. Because the ECU dose not use the
knock sensors below 3000 RPM the engine can spark knock like crazy and the
ECU will never know it is happening.

We can address this by using map B in the FTC to retard the ignition timing
enough below 3000 RPM to suppress the boost induced spark knock.
Remember that the fuel map must be tuned first so the high RPM ignition timing
will settle in and then you can see what you need to retard below 3000 RPM.

And:If you are using water injection, you may find that you will have to retard timing
below 3000 RPM before the engine goes into boost. This is from the superior
boost induces spark knock suppression in the upper RPM and is common.

You do not want large sudden changes in the retard values from cell to cell. Say
if you find that in one cell you need 5 degrees of retard you will want to smooth in
the cells around it..


It's getting COMPLICATED!!:drinking: :drinking:
I have the emange and it seems to be working....I just need to play with it.
I'll be contacting them this week and ask them as well.
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Postby Slut » Mon Nov 03, 2008 4:48 pm

Whats the timing supposed to be at WOT usually... After all my mods, only thing I really need to slap in is an AFC to tune, but got the GM knock sensors, no CEL's, but still feel my timing is being pulled alot. Scanners showin like +1-10 degree's anywhere between there, is the walbro 190 runnin it so rich its retardin the timing? I know i got to get a wideband too.. all in due time, I just wanna feel this car in action. Doesnt really feel like much, just loud. Also, just outta curiousity, cranking the car over in the past day or so, sounds strange. Almost like bad timing, yet itll crank over after a crank or so and run fine. Never used to hesitate like that on startup... I blow something? Should I do a compression test? Also what size injectors are stock comparin them to like NA supra's 305cc's...

Thanks guys.
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Re: Timing......

Postby SirThomas88 » Wed Sep 15, 2010 2:50 pm

I'm gonna bump this. Yes I know it's over a year old. but it's an interesting subject and I'm curious to learn more about timing.
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Re: Timing......

Postby JavaJoe_2 » Sat Sep 18, 2010 10:56 am

I ended up pulling the timing like Greg had, I don't know enough about it and didn't want to mess with it. I will let the tuning shop deal with it.
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