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SolaraGuy.com • View topic - Gen 2 Aftermarket Parts Listing
Talk about aftermarket Toyota Solara Gen 2 and 2.5 upgrades.

Gen 2 Aftermarket Parts Listing

Postby SolaraDevil » Sun Aug 03, 2008 7:31 pm

somebody have the springs from tein in a Solara 3.3
???
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Postby panic » Sun Aug 10, 2008 6:10 am

I'm looking for a cold air kit for my G2 3.3, but all the leads I track down described as "cold air" are simply aftermarket open sided filters at the end of a curved extension.

Is there a product out there?

Some of what is claimed and posted about intakes is complete rubbish. In general, there are a few things that may help:
1. new tube has larger radii and/or diameter than original plumbing - improves air volume
2. the tube (and the entire tract) must have a smooth interior wall - the flexible, conformable flex tubes are completely worth - the spiral or corrugated inner wall drastically reduces air-flow
3. new filter area is larger than the OEM - but not always an accurate comparo since not all filters flow the same per square inch of area.
4. a filter re-located to anywhere inside the engine compartment gets only pre-heated air from the engine. Under WOT the heat throw-off from the exhaust and hot air pulled through the radiator by the fan is huge.
5. pointing an external intake scoop forward does not produce enough "free supercharging" to make much difference, the wind pressure is only about 1.2% at 100 mph
6. even a K&N has to be big enough to work; example: a 3.3 peaking at 6,000 RPM needs about 47 square inches of filter to work (6" × 8" panel, etc.).
Formula: engine size in liters * RPM ÷ 418
3.3 × 6,000 = 19,800, ÷ 418 = 47.4 square inches
7. when you remove the original stuff, you get a bit more intake roar (sounds nice, though!), but I'm not sure if it cancels any Helmholtz benefits? Is the stock air box a resonator?
8. the biggest power boost you can get from changing the intake duct is cold air - the difference between 70° ambient from the exterior vs. 150° or more inside the bay is large. The duct from the entry need not be continuous diameter - it can end in a big box containing the filter, then another tube back to the TB.

What I'm looking for is an intake that has a remote tube ending outside the engine bay in front of the bodywork (grill, under bumper, etc.). The better ones will have a water trap to prevent rain and road dirt from reaching the filter.

Thanks for any leads or links.
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Postby PhreakdOut » Sun Aug 10, 2008 6:20 am

Tacti built his own CAI. The battery is in the way. If you mount it 90 from current position or relocate it into the trunk, then you have access to run the tubing down behind the driver's side headlight and mount the filter behind the driver's side fog light. (Lots of air there.)

If you wanted to get clever, remove the fogs and make a ram air setup. (A bit of work.)

I'd like to see someone make a box where the battery is and adapt it to use a flat K&N filter. Run a ram air from the fog light hole and up into the box. The air would be cooler than the engine bay's and filter cleaning would be easier. You may be able to modify a standard polished aluminum battery box and mount it in the current battery position. (Then you just need to add hole, mount tubes and adapt a filter to fit the box.)
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Postby panic » Sun Aug 10, 2008 6:24 am

"modify a standard polished aluminum battery box and mount it in the current battery position"

Great - hadn't thought of that.

Yah, I was looking for an easy answer - I know where I stand now, thanks.
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Postby PXLpainter » Sun Aug 10, 2008 11:18 am

^^ Huh?? :think:

If that was sarcasm, you fail. :roll:

It's tough to design a ram-air setup for the Gen V6, but a CAI setup could be done but not without a lot of work and you'd still have to move the battery in any case.

There are no 2-hr shortcuts to that project.
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Postby panic » Sun Aug 10, 2008 3:50 pm

Nope - agreeing with you, I'm still getting used to this stuff, didn't want to overlook anything easy and re-invent the wheel!
If it's going to be tough to do I want to find out before I buy/cut anything.
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Postby gnegroni » Sun Aug 10, 2008 11:05 pm

panic wrote:I'm looking for a cold air kit for my G2 3.3, but all the leads I track down described as "cold air" are simply aftermarket open sided filters at the end of a curved extension.

Is there a product out there?

Some of what is claimed and posted about intakes is complete rubbish. In general, there are a few things that may help:
1. new tube has larger radii and/or diameter than original plumbing - improves air volume
2. the tube (and the entire tract) must have a smooth interior wall - the flexible, conformable flex tubes are completely worth - the spiral or corrugated inner wall drastically reduces air-flow
3. new filter area is larger than the OEM - but not always an accurate comparo since not all filters flow the same per square inch of area.
4. a filter re-located to anywhere inside the engine compartment gets only pre-heated air from the engine. Under WOT the heat throw-off from the exhaust and hot air pulled through the radiator by the fan is huge.
5. pointing an external intake scoop forward does not produce enough "free supercharging" to make much difference, the wind pressure is only about 1.2% at 100 mph
6. even a K&N has to be big enough to work; example: a 3.3 peaking at 6,000 RPM needs about 47 square inches of filter to work (6" × 8" panel, etc.).
Formula: engine size in liters * RPM ÷ 418
3.3 × 6,000 = 19,800, ÷ 418 = 47.4 square inches
7. when you remove the original stuff, you get a bit more intake roar (sounds nice, though!), but I'm not sure if it cancels any Helmholtz benefits? Is the stock air box a resonator?
8. the biggest power boost you can get from changing the intake duct is cold air - the difference between 70° ambient from the exterior vs. 150° or more inside the bay is large. The duct from the entry need not be continuous diameter - it can end in a big box containing the filter, then another tube back to the TB.

What I'm looking for is an intake that has a remote tube ending outside the engine bay in front of the bodywork (grill, under bumper, etc.). The better ones will have a water trap to prevent rain and road dirt from reaching the filter.

Thanks for any leads or links.

Please bear with me...I had previously looked for a lot of info on this subject.

I believe the Toyota Air Filter assembly provides an "adequate" filtered air supply but more so to quiet down the engine: RESTRICTIVE. Sometime ago, I was performing DeepCreep cleaning alongside with complete air assembly and left out the elephant trunk looking inlet on reassembly (stock box with filter in-place)... I quickly put it back; the engine not only had deep low growl but also introduced vibrations...didn't like it!

Numbered replies:

(1&2). The CPE air intake system is one of the best solutions for the 3.3, even though its an SRI...it has larger diameter intake tube and works AFR (set or tuneable). I don't know about CPE CAI extentions yet, but like PXL said its difficult to do (even for somebody with the 2.4L engine like tacti). CAI might also have faster flow velocity since the air is disturbed earlier in air induction stage than with an stock or extended SRI.

Cheap CAI:
Image

(3) K&N oiled cotton flows better than paper for the same size; they have demo on some auto part stores.

(4) Many people confuse CAI Cold Air Intake and SRI Short Ram Intake (and some take advantage of that). Still, having an extended SRI taking hot air from under hood (but further away from heat sources) cancels some of the benefits of higher air flow but to a lesser degree than a simple SRI. Still, higher HP on any SRI over stock might come from shortening of the air intake tract which usually gives more HP sometimes at the expense of torque. Still, for some people the pros top the cons.

(5) The 1.2% might not seem that significant, but having a scoop (nozzle) raises flow velocity. Less pumping losses?

(6) I'm lost (please explain what is the purpose of formula). Still, I think this follows what you are saying: Massive RX8 filter

(7) Helmholtz... finally the answer for the open window and/or sunroof buffeting (vibration) felt inside cabin. I believe that is the only purpose for those multiple resonators (I think my car has 3).

(8 ) Completely true...alas, in real life and hot weather, it might not make much of a difference.

One of the cleanest air intake designs I have seen is the RX8 REVi. Bigger K&N round filter with "horn" towards MAF, inside a closed box for cooler air intake. There is also a RamAirDuct.

In the RX8 case, they can make a cold air extension and put the filter directly in front of radiator: Image.

Scoop anybody?
Image

K&N (others too), sell a sock type cover for filters that prevent excessive dirt and water from going into the filter:
Image

Don't mean to threadjack, but after pondering on the options I wish I could have a stock 3.3L airbox (additional air intake ducts over the 2.4L and bigger entry)...maybe even modify it to allow one of the air ducts to act as air scoop (ram air). It might be the closest to the REVi system. Maybe you could make a ram-air add-on that dumps directly onto the stock scoop (dedicate 1/2 the scoop Big 3.3L engine bay pic). This way, most the dirt and water would fall into a white canister our engines have below the battery.

In the end, it all comes down to the limits of your imagination and how much $$$ you can dish out. :)
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Postby panic » Mon Aug 11, 2008 3:24 pm

Re: "(6) I'm lost (please explain what is the purpose of formula)"
That's just the K&N formula for minimum filter area, converted to liters.
In inches: Displacement × RPM × VE ÷ 25,500

(4) IMHO there's probably lower air temperature available in some underhood areas than others, depending on how air flows at speed.
A temp probe could be tie-wrapped in a few places to test this. At idle, traffic, etc. I'm sure underhood air exceeds 200° F because there's nowhere for hot air (radiator, block, exhaust) to go, but it probably flushes out at higher speed - but what area (if any) is swept down to ambient???

(5) I'm having a bit of argy at the SCTA/BNI site about this. I can't understand how increasing the inlet size (above actual inlet diameter) does not create more velocity which translates back to pressure when the X-area increases in the plenum.
The opinion offered is "the larger opening creates aero drag" - this is not only "unresponsive (common term at trials, means "you said something, but you didn't answer the question"), but irrelevant where the scoop is in "hidden" in the existing frontal area.

(7) For those not familiar, a volume in between the atmosphere and the carburetor (not a manifold plenum) can produce very small positive pressure at a tuned RPM. Quoting from my own booklet:
"Concept: ... improve performance by use of a tuned common air filter housing or “box”. This is especially useful where the tuned intake tract length has been selected to add power at or near the existing power peak. The engine should have between two and four cylinders for effective use (a V6 would have 2 boxes).
The principle involved is the “Helmholtz resonator”. Herman L. F. von Helmholtz (1821-1894) published “On the Sensations of Tone” in 1862, in which careful calculations allow incoming air to develop slight positive pressure (mild supercharging) through “flask resonance” (the behavior of sound and pressure inside a bottle) inside the air-box, and provide additional flow through the carburetors.
It is the size and shape of the box itself which provides the benefit. The interior volume of the box is a function of several factors, including the engine displacement, the number of cylinders, and the RPM at which the enhancement is to occur. The volume affects the tuned speed somewhat, but is secondary to air intake tube length."

I thought of an easy test to determine if the existing air box is intended to act as a Helmholtz device.
Add a "stuffer" to the air box (something clean and large like a cardboard box, or even a balloon) to reduce the volume by perhaps 1/2 to 2/3 (without obstructing any openings - use duct-tape). If the engine feels weaker in low to mid ranges it may have been from altered resonance characteristics.
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Postby gnegroni » Mon Aug 11, 2008 5:25 pm

panic wrote:Re: "(6) I'm lost (please explain what is the purpose of formula)"
That's just the K&N formula for minimum filter area, converted to liters.
In inches: Displacement × RPM × VE ÷ 25,500

(4) IMHO there's probably lower air temperature available in some underhood areas than others, depending on how air flows at speed.
A temp probe could be tie-wrapped in a few places to test this. At idle, traffic, etc. I'm sure underhood air exceeds 200° F because there's nowhere for hot air (radiator, block, exhaust) to go, but it probably flushes out at higher speed - but what area (if any) is swept down to ambient???

(5) I'm having a bit of argy at the SCTA/BNI site about this. I can't understand how increasing the inlet size (above actual inlet diameter) does not create more velocity which translates back to pressure when the X-area increases in the plenum.
The opinion offered is "the larger opening creates aero drag" - this is not only "unresponsive (common term at trials, means "you said something, but you didn't answer the question"), but irrelevant where the scoop is in "hidden" in the existing frontal area.

(7) For those not familiar, a volume in between the atmosphere and the carburetor (not a manifold plenum) can produce very small positive pressure at a tuned RPM. Quoting from my own booklet:
"Concept: ... improve performance by use of a tuned common air filter housing or “box”. This is especially useful where the tuned intake tract length has been selected to add power at or near the existing power peak. The engine should have between two and four cylinders for effective use (a V6 would have 2 boxes).
The principle involved is the “Helmholtz resonator”. Herman L. F. von Helmholtz (1821-1894) published “On the Sensations of Tone” in 1862, in which careful calculations allow incoming air to develop slight positive pressure (mild supercharging) through “flask resonance” (the behavior of sound and pressure inside a bottle) inside the air-box, and provide additional flow through the carburetors.
It is the size and shape of the box itself which provides the benefit. The interior volume of the box is a function of several factors, including the engine displacement, the number of cylinders, and the RPM at which the enhancement is to occur. The volume affects the tuned speed somewhat, but is secondary to air intake tube length."

I thought of an easy test to determine if the existing air box is intended to act as a Helmholtz device.
Add a "stuffer" to the air box (something clean and large like a cardboard box, or even a balloon) to reduce the volume by perhaps 1/2 to 2/3 (without obstructing any openings - use duct-tape). If the engine feels weaker in low to mid ranges it may have been from altered resonance characteristics.

(6) Thanks for the formula...however, whats the VE for the 2.4L or 3.3L? Is there an assumed VE?

(4) To a lesser degree of importance, we could test transient and steady state changes...eventually hot temp flushes out at speed, but if constantly in traffic, temps will remain high. STi and Mazdaspeed6 (or 3) owners have benefits from changing the intercooler from top-mount to frount-mount even while at speed. If I only had a few thermistors, telemetry and datalogging capacity...

(5) Not sure I understood what you said...They might be right about greater aerodynamic drag or change flow characteristics around the area of the scoop. Nevertheless, if (scoop gained power)>(aerodynamic drag losses)= its all good baby!

(7) Some cars employ variable length intake manifolds (BMW), multiple plenums (RX8, Taurus SHO) and/or tuned length manifolds to enhance such effects on a wider RPM range. Pumping losses could be lowered a bit by up-to-7PSI bursts. If we could only dyno test... This might be one of the reasons why SRIs or CAIs don't offer off-the-books performance improvements from greatly increased and cooled air supplies.

Anybody willing to donate a 3.3L airbox (and tubing) for testing? :D
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Postby panic » Tue Aug 12, 2008 6:28 am

"Is there an assumed VE"
100 is the default, but for an engine with VVT and tuned intake perhaps 105 is safer since a bit more is harmless if wrong.

(5) My argument was that the ram effect limit was based on the principle that the air inlet size was fixed, but I can't find any technical reason for this.
Yes, an 8" scoop on top of the hood will reduce the top speed (perhaps) more than any power it will add - but what if the entry is completely shrouded by the existing frontal area (area does not increase), and located where drag is already high (Cd not effected)?
There are Bonneville cars running upwards of 200 that have exponential horns projecting ahead of the bodywork for just this purpose, and the rules are very critical as to interpretation of "what is a radiator shell", etc. - so you know this works. Granatelli used projecting horns in the lamp sockets of his 1960 Chrysler 300F at Daytona.

Image

(7) True, in fact by trashing any calculated length characteristics in the original inlet system a CAI etc. could be improving mass flow, and still reduce power. Except for the obvious space considerations, the SRI tube could be made of 2 telescoping sizes (ID #1 = OD #2), and a manual cable could be used to slide the length up and down under power like a trombone. If the tube is curved, 2 separate sliders could be used to keep the bulk down. Once the length is known (if actually within a range you can fit) a solenoid can move it triggered by a lead to some electronic event like the VVT to switch from low to high range.
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Postby gnegroni » Tue Aug 12, 2008 11:41 am

panic wrote:"Is there an assumed VE"
100 is the default, but for an engine with VVT and tuned intake perhaps 105 is safer since a bit more is harmless if wrong.

(5) My argument was that the ram effect limit was based on the principle that the air inlet size was fixed, but I can't find any technical reason for this.
Yes, an 8" scoop on top of the hood will reduce the top speed (perhaps) more than any power it will add - but what if the entry is completely shrouded by the existing frontal area (area does not increase), and located where drag is already high (Cd not effected)?
There are Bonneville cars running upwards of 200 that have exponential horns projecting ahead of the bodywork for just this purpose, and the rules are very critical as to interpretation of "what is a radiator shell", etc. - so you know this works. Granatelli used projecting horns in the lamp sockets of his 1960 Chrysler 300F at Daytona.

Image

(7) True, in fact by trashing any calculated length characteristics in the original inlet system a CAI etc. could be improving mass flow, and still reduce power. Except for the obvious space considerations, the SRI tube could be made of 2 telescoping sizes (ID #1 = OD #2), and a manual cable could be used to slide the length up and down under power like a trombone. If the tube is curved, 2 separate sliders could be used to keep the bulk down. Once the length is known (if actually within a range you can fit) a solenoid can move it triggered by a lead to some electronic event like the VVT to switch from low to high range.

I found 2 sites on VE:
Down the the formula
Good explanation and another way to look at it

Typically only Forced Induction engines see more than 100% VE, but its possible on a Naturally Aspirated engine. In our case our engines are probably not 100%, but possibly more than the 77% for the 1999 Z28 used as example in the first link. This probably due to VVTi as well as DOHC heads too.

(5) :sweet: I've seen people take out foglamps to make ram air scoops...not that I'll do it to mine (light bulb turns on then back off due to $$$). Check what Volant has as add-on (scoop) to their air filter systems (in light grey):
Image

(7) That is a pretty neat idea panic...might be worth pursuing. It might also work in exhaust, where you are not constricted by fixed length as much as in the engine compartment.
http://www.autozine.org/technical_school/engine/tech_engine_2.htm
Manufacturers just deal with length and resonance in the intake manifold, either staged or variable. Maybe Toyota just dropped the T-VIS (later ACIS) in favor of VVTi and the resonance ducks and filterbox design.

Here is another alternative Cowl Induction (http://www.8thcivic.com/forums/bolt-ons-all-motor/80540-cowl-induction-cold-ram-air-si.html):
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Postby theprodigy79 » Tue Aug 12, 2008 12:06 pm

Master List updated with Crower stuff. Please keep this thread as a parts listing only... questions and discussion will just throw people off and lose focus...
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Postby gnegroni » Tue Aug 12, 2008 12:24 pm

Oh, and I also found another article on the Mazda 2.3L engine that might shed some light on the possible resonance effect of the air filter box...

http://www.mazda6tech.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=14&Itemid=1

Near the end of the article, they mention VAD. It works on the airbox to limit the amount of air (and noise) until 4500rpm. In our case, it doesn't eliminate the possibility of it being a resonance chamber, but shows otherwise (due to multiple openings I guess).

DocJohn's mod for the V6 taps the Toyota VAD to help decrease the lag and improve performance...

http://www.solaraguy.com/viewtopic.php?t=15925&highlight=docjohns
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Postby panic » Tue Aug 12, 2008 1:36 pm

The exhaust is more diff to do because the weight of the sliding parts is BIGGG, not to mention all the clamps, hangars.
Typically, they just make a curved bypass as the "long" path, and a flapper that chooses 1 of 2 on demand so no moving parts.
I haven't had anything off mine yet, and can't find anything useful in the PDFs.

Does someone have a picture of what's inside the stock air intake that feeds the box (behind the radiator support)?
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Postby gnegroni » Tue Aug 12, 2008 2:17 pm

Picture all these parts matching up...might help (taken from the Parts Catalog):

Image

Compare to the 2.4L and you might see why I desire the 3.3L assembly:
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