Vortech V-5 SC 3MZ Gen 2 ??

[Sebas007]

I know you guys like videos

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OCDyMaoc3rs
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bGJaCc0gnUQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aAK2jPvaZzE



I don't know where this long aventure will bring me...but I'll not hide, I'm aiming RIPP to do something in my story.

http://www.rippmods.com/

[PXLpainter]

DAMN Sebas - DO IT!

[Sebas007]

First, I want to build a serious case about all the parts involved in a boosted application.

- First, do someone on this forum knows a tranny pro or someone serious who can prove me the limit of the U151E tranny (5-speed sequential tranny on V6 Gen 2 Solaras). If there anything I can do to make safely handle more power, aside tranny cooler.

I found that to upgrade the valve body is a must. Don't think it will make the tranny stronger though.

- Second, as I've posted earlier in this thread, the 1MZ and 3MZ share the same exact internal (aside piston diameter), as Oteck says and Oteck is one monster tuner. What are the limit of those internals regarding WHP and PSIg. If someone can confirm or discredit that the 1MZ and 3MZ are sharing the same internals, aside the piston diamater, show me.


-Third, the exhaust headers and the rest of the exhaust line. I will talk with RIPP...but I would like to use Jeff initiative and go with JPP system.


- Do you see any other issues ?? VVT-i ??...read this from Acura forum (RIPP thread http://tl.acurazine.com/forums/showthread.php?t=127482&page=2&pp=40) that for Mitsubishi, it is easier to get boost form the Mivec (VTEC of Mitsubishi). I just read it react like the VTEC, mechanicly change the cam shaft profile...not hydraulicly. Bottom line, the Mivec is a bit easier to manage (you know when it switches around 4300 RPM)

Vortech has re-engineerd the centrifugal SC and streamlined it’s operation to build a naturally progressive boost curve that increases as the engine build RPM. As the engine speed increases the Vortech becomes less of a crank load and more of a power addes because the engine is producing more . The condition is a perfect match to the VTEC found in your cars, as proven by the simpler and “dumber” MIVEC powered Mitsubishi. What we leanred there is an engine with variable cam, and valve timing needs less blower RPM to produce more boost. By way of example the MIVEC car only needs 20000 rpm to produce 8psi, were as the none MIVEC car needs 32000, that’s a considerable amount of crank HP loss over the entire RPM band.

The roots type charger used by the competition is much faster to boost off the line but (creating the wheel spin situation Mr. Steve pointed out earlier in the thread) then becomes more of a load at higher RPM’s actually creating a power loss, and counter productive in these platforms. Therefore, whiles it’s a great set up on most low revving engines the Vortech will be a much better match or rather a more Dynamic boost curve to the technology and engine size found in your cars.

- Any other issues you guys can see ?? Space...

The turbine side would have plenty of space with the battery in the trunk.
The pulley side will get just enough space.
The drive shaft (inside a protective cylinder) will have probably less space to pass thru because of the big radiator hose, passenger side. I don't think it is the biggest issue to solve in this because when I roughly check it...I see space to settle the whole thing but it will be flush.

[Down2TheC]

Ugh... that first vid has an awful noise! Was that the belt crying for some belt dressing? Yikes.

[Sebas007]

Ugh... that first vid has an awful noise! Was that the belt crying for some belt dressing? Yikes.

Yep at idle the compressor turbine makes a annoying sound I agree !

[Sebas007]

I forget to talk about compression ratio.

1MZ = 10.5:1
Source : here

Mitsubishi 3.8 = 10.5:1
http://www.brandoncars.com/mitsubishi/eclipseSpecs.php

3MZ = I found 10.8.1, 10.5:1 and 10.1:1
http://autospeed.com/cms/A_2106/article.html


Refering to garrett turbo tech : compression ratio
http://www.turbobygarrett.com/turbobygarrett/tech_center/turbo_tech102.html#d

I just wonder how 3Mz is higher then 1MZ since the stroke is 83 mm for both and the block supposed to be the same. The only thing is the cylinder head are diffrent. Do I'm wrong ? What else can explain it ? What is the real compression ratio ?



If it is 10.8 what do you think would be the maximum PSIg I could safely use ? Don't answer 0, thanks !

[PXLpainter]

I thought the ratio was diff because of the shape of the head of the piston - more convex creating a tighter airspace?

I'm probably way off... I"m just guessing dammit!

[Sebas007]

I thought the ratio was diff because of the shape of the head of the piston - more convex creating a tighter airspace?

I'm probably way off... I"m just guessing dammit!

No Jeff you can be right...it would make sense ! As I said earlier, it is the only way I can explain it to myself.

[Sebas007]

Jeff you must read this !

http://www.importperformancetrans.com/toyotaauto.shtml

Might be something to add...ouch around 3K tho !!!
I'll ask them if they already made it on a Toyota U151E or a similar tranny.

[Sebas007]

I've read it better and for 3375$, if I read well, you'll have a whole new highly upgraded tranny.


Jeff....read here
http://www.importperformancetrans.com/toyotaauto.shtml
For around 600$ you can have the upgraded VB (Valve body)
if you add some more $$ to it you can combine it to a tranny cooler and it should make the job you are seeking Jeff. Firm positive shifting FTW

[Sebas007]

Here's the email I send them...I'll receive answer next week. Hope it is possible to understand what I'm trying to say...

Title : Toyota U151E upgrade‏

Hi John and IPT crew,

I'm planning to make some "crazy" upgrade on my car. I want to boost my 2006 Toyota Solara SE V6 up with a centrifugal S/C with around 8-10 PSIg. I want to make it slowly but wisely and upgrade all the components who will take the extra power stress. I made some google search about how I could upgrade my U151E (really slushy tranny) to make it possible. I'm pretty concern about the slipping time between shift and also about how much power stress a factory U151E tranny can take. Since, it is not a popular platform for serious tuner, I'm stuck with my question until I fall right on your website. Here are my questions.



Based of your Toyota auto tranny page

http://www.importperformancetrans.com/toyotaauto.shtml



- The 3375$ kit does it include an extra whole new highly upgrade U151E tranny ?? My first thought was I had to bring my car and/or sotck U151E tranny to your facilities and you were about to tottaly upgrade it, is that it ?? Or it is like buying a whole new tranny ??



What are the day to day befenits of buying this over just a VB upgrade + tranny cooler ?

What kind of power & boost, if I can ask that way, this upgrade will let me safely go to ?

Do the stock ECU will see something wrong with it, oil pressure and anything else that can bring CELs ??



- Under the big kit I can read you have solution if we seek for a shift kit. (last item in the Valve Bodies category)



Do this upgrade will let me having more safe whp ? (less slippage = colder tranny = more safe whp ?)

If I go this route, what size of tranny cooler you suggest me, in the Other category, to go with ? Does it make a huge difference on the size ?

What you recommand me to go with this VB+TC combo ? What a custom torque converter will give me (main purpose of it) ?

Again, do the stock ECU will see something wrong with it, oil pressure and anything else that can bring CELs ??



That are my questions for now. Again, I'm serious in my project mostly because it is a rare setup to start with. But if you offer something to help it, is that my whole idea make sense, isn't it ?


I will be happy to make you part of my project.



Sébastien

[Sebas007]

Mail to RIPP modifications

Title : Custom SDS Vortech S/C‏

Hi guys,

I'm planning to make some "crazy" upgrade on my car. I want to boost my 2006 Toyota Solara SE V6 up with a centrifugal S/C with around 8-10 PSIg. It is a non really common project. I've heard you are the right person for it. To acheive this I'll need to upgrade some important parts. For the tranny I found a great tranny shop in NJ to upgrade my U151E auto tranny. My question for you will oriented towards engine and exhaust. Why I found you ? I was trying to find a way to get more power, TRD never made S/C (based on Eaton M60 or M90) for 2004+ Solara V6, turbo setup can be complicated and ask for more maintenance. When I saw TRD S/C for the Scion Tc using an centrifugal Vortech S/C with a shaft...I told myself that was the perfect setup I'll aim for. And then with some few search on google I found your website and some youtube video. I was impressed with the Mivec 3.8L Eclipse performance.

Now, let's talk of my case. Like I've said I have a 2006 Toyota Solare SE V6 with the 3MZ-FE engine and the U151E auto tranny.
The 3MZ-FE Toyota engine is a 3.3L 24 valves engine. It has a compression ratio of 10.8. This compression ratio is one of my concern. On N/A application is correct but with the extra PSIg I think it will go wrong. The Mitsubishi 3.8L MIVEC engine has a 10.5 compression ratio.
So, it will be my first question, I want to achieve around 275-300 whp, if I dynoed my car stock at 185 whp, how many PSIg we will need to setup this up ?? Do I will need to install forged internals with low compression piston ??

Now, the exhaust system. I know that JP Performance in CA, did a custom exhaust system (headers to hi-flow cat for the 3MZ Solara) I would like to go this route but I want to know what you think about it. I don't think you would like to do such a big work in design and machining for 1 or very few sells, isn't it ??


Before verifying all the rest, I think the first question should be if I will get enough space under the hood for it. I would say yes for myself. I already relocated the battery in the trunk and it gives me really similar space like the Mitsubishi 3.8L have. The only concern I have is with the radiator hose on the passenger side but there should be a way to make it even so. I'll include some pics of my "under the hood".

look at the bottom left of the picture, it is the radiator hose I'm talking about. I will send you other pics as you wish.
http://i167.photobucket.com/albums/u160 ... CT1228.jpg

Now how it looks like nowasays.
http://i167.photobucket.com/albums/u160 ... CT1234.jpg


I'll wait for your general answer !

Thanks

Sébastien

[michaels artic frost]

very interesting.

[gnegroni]

Keep us posted Mr. Pioneer Admin!

[Sebas007]

Keep us postedm Mr. Pioneer Admin!

Call me that when it will be done !